Apex Skimmer Issue

[Jim Tansey]

Before I rant any further on an issue that could be my fault I'll ask for a review of my skimmer commands. What I am trying to do is to turn off the skimmer in the event that the return pump power is lost or the skimmer reserve container is full as evidenced by a float switch in the container. My Octopus is a great skimmer but VERY sensitive to the sump water level, a time delay is also desired to insure the water level reaches the correct point before turning the skimmer on. This setup failed during the storm flooding my living floor because the skimmer did not turn off when the float switch opened. The float switch is connected through a breakout box to the apex AND DID NOT FAIL it clearly showed OPEN on the display

Jim

 

[Intheflesh]

The coding looks right ( I think ha)

One thing to check is the operation of your switch. Is it normally open or closed? As a quick aside, Once I ordered 2 float switches to act as a high/low switches for my ATO. The problem was that they gave me 2 different switches, one was "Normally Closed" and the other "Open." I couldn't figure it out. The ATTO would turn on, but I couldn't get it to turn off. Checked the code 100s of times. Then I took out the multimeter to test continuity, and the two switches were working opposite of one another. That's one thing to check.

So for line 4 if you want to shutoff your skimmer to shut off when the switch is in the 'float' position., you would want a switch that is normally closed, and then when it floats it goes to open. If you have a normally open switch, then when it floats, the circuit closes, so you would want to change that line off code to read If SW1 CLOSED then OFF

Edit: I just read the last line, where you said the Apex showed the switch as OPEN. Since that is the case, then my explanation doesn't apply.
What skimmer is it? Is it AC or DC? and which EB8 outlet is it plugged into? Outlets 1-3 and 4-7 TRIAC to switch on/off. They do not operate well with devices <10 watts. They can turn devices on, but have a hard time turning them off. If you have a DC powered skimmer that might be using less than 10 watts, you should try plugging it into outlet 4 or 8 which uses mechanical relays.

 

[Chris A.]

All looks good to me
What’s the sw1 program?

 

[Jim Tansey]

SW 1 is the float switch for the skimmer overflow container if thats what you mean.

I am aware of the triac issue, another poor decision by Apex they claim relays are to expensive.

Jim

 

[Chris A.]

Think I figured out we’re the problem is but I don’t know the codes, I usually ask lol
When return is off their needs a command to turn off the skimmer instead of the overflow switch. Don’t know why the switch isn’t working but I’d want the skimmer off before it gets full

 

[Chris A.]

Going to check real quick

 

[Chris A.]

Fallback ON
Set ON
If Outlet ReturnPump = OFF Then OFF
Defer 003:00 Then ON

 

[Jim Tansey]

No your on the wrong road, its not telling the switch to change states its talking to the skimmer outlet.

This post is in reference to your #5 EDIT

Jim

 

[Chris A.]

The sw1 no clue @cilyjr knows all that stuff

 

[Jim Tansey]

Fallback ON
Set ON
If Outlet ReturnPump = OFF Then OFF
Defer 003:00 Then ON

This doesn't address the skimmer container overflow issue.

 

[Chris A.]

Not if everything is running right but will make your skimmer turn off if your return does. I’m assuming the overflow would be under normal operation of the return and skimmer and the cup is just full. Since the water level rises when the return is off theskimmer would overflow right away, this will stop that overflow from happening but wouldn’t stop normal operational skimmate from overflowing. Hope someone else can get you all the code needed. Wish I could be more helpful

 

[this is me]

What I am trying to do is to turn off the skimmer in the event that the return pump power is lost or the skimmer reserve container is full as evidenced by a float switch in the container. My Octopus is a great skimmer but VERY sensitive to the sump water level, a time delay is also desired to insure the water level reaches the correct point before turning the skimmer on.
Jim

Jim,
While I don't have an Apex, I'm pretty sure it can be programmed the same way as my Profilux.
What I put in bold from your quote is important. You want to stop the skimmer way before the collection cup can even fill up. For this reason, the best way is to have the switch not in the skimmer cup but an inch or so above the normal operating water line. When the return pump is shut off, the water will back feed and the sump water will rise(assuming you don't have a check valve on the return which you really shouldn't have). The float or water sensor will see the water and it will cause the outlet on the skimmer to turn off. This is a better way to control a sensitive skimmer due to water level.
You also can double layer protection by adding another float or sensor in the skimmer cup and do the same thing. But unless your critters are having an orgy in the tank all the time, there's no reason why the skimmer cup would overflow without you knowing it.

 

[Jim Tansey]

I know exactly what you are saying and I've been through this my solution was to extend the stem of the float switch down nearer to the base of the container thus it would require much less water volume to trip it. I also looked at putting the switch in the skimmer and maybe thats a better place but my skimmer is next to impossible to remove. The other factors to consider are the water volumes of the skimmer/cup and the drain rate into the skimmer container by the time the skimmer turns off it may be to late to prevent an overflow.

Jim,


While I don't have an Apex, I'm pretty sure it can be programmed the same way as my Profilux.
What I put in bold from your quote is important. You want to stop the skimmer way before the collection cup can even fill up. For this reason, the best way is to have the switch not in the skimmer cup but an inch or so above the normal operating water line. When the return pump is shut off, the water will back feed and the sump water will rise(assuming you don't have a check valve on the return which you really shouldn't have). The float or water sensor will see the water and it will cause the outlet on the skimmer to turn off. This is a better way to control a sensitive skimmer due to water level.
You also can double layer protection by adding another float or sensor in the skimmer cup and do the same thing. But unless your critters are having an orgy in the tank all the time, there's no reason why the skimmer cup would overflow without you knowing it.

,

 

[cilyjr]

What's the slider on apex Fusion set to Auto or on?

 

[cilyjr]

For the skimmer pump that is

 

[Jim Tansey]

Auto (I'm not that bad)

 

[cilyjr]

You'd be suprised

 

[cilyjr]

On thing I notice is you've got fallback set to on on a device you're worried could flood your floor. That's not what caused this but I thought I'd mention that.

Have you checked to make sure the outlet on the eb8 is not stuck on? It's happened

 

[Jim Tansey]

The outlet switches fine and float switch has never had a problem in fact I use this function all the time when I empty the skimmer reserve, I added a inline connector to the float switch when it needs to be emptied I simply disconnect the switch (opening the switch) the skimmer stops and I empty the reserve reconnect the switch and the skimmer turns on after the two minute pause.
One thing I did not mention and will do my best to explain, my Apex Fusion has three states; connected, not connected, and doesn't know its not connected. It goes into the "doesn't know its not connected" phase during interruptions with the internet signal such as we had during the storm looking at the computer screen it would appear that all is fine, no note "NOT CONNECTED TO FUSION" but it's not communicating with Fusion or the Apex and provides no message telling you that, again all looks normal. In this phase if one was to try and input a manual command such turning on a light the slider acts like a two pole momentary switch, toggling it from AUTO to ON or OFF it will snap back to the AUTO position, thats your signal that all brain activity has ceased. It was in this phase when I had my flood, what all this means I don't know do they all have this third phase?

Jim

 

[cilyjr]

Hmmm. This is a fusion issue NOT an apex issue. And it may be one that we need to get Russ involved with. I'm at work now let me think on this and see if I can figure something out