new to salt water tanks..

[Matt L.]

First, I'd like to say Hi to everyone!

Hello.

I am also new to salt water aquarium....

Everyone was new at one point. We all remember what it was like.

Nonetheless, I need help! I bought a 72G Bowfront tank from a friend 3 weeks ago. The tank came with 9 Damsels (2 blue, 2 yellow-tail, 3 4-stripe or zebra, and 2 dominos), a Koran Angel, a Gold-Rimmed Surgeon (Tang), a Maroon Clown, snails, hermit crabs, about 50-60 lbs. of live rocks, and the substrate consists of curshed corals.

Oh my goodness!!! Okay, one of the most unbending tenets in saltwater aquariums is that you can regrettably only have a limited number of fish in a tank of a given size. This is what is called your stocking limit. You may also hear the term stocking density. Your friend, while possibly meaning well, put way, way, way too many fish in a 72gal bowfront!
Keeping too many saltwater fish causes a number of problems for you and your fish. Saltwater fish are used to much more elbow room than freshwater fish like goldfish. Saltwater can easily become stressed under crowded conditions. And saltwater fish handle their stress by becoming sick and ultimately dying. I'm not saying all the fish may die, but I want to assert as respectfully as possible that your friend, possibly while not knowing, committed one of the cardinal "sins" of saltwater fish keeping.

Overstocking a tank also causes a number of problems for you. The fish will rapidly build up waste. With so many fish and external power filters, the resulting nitrate level will require weekly large water changes. With such rapid nitrate production, algae will be difficult to control, and fish may manifest their discomfort from nitrates by becoming sick.

So first things first, ditch the majority of the fish! The damsels, while pretty, are wholly unnecessary and often become very aggressive towards other fish. I would advise you to get rid of all of them. This may require removing the rock temporarily from the tank. It is crucial to remove all of them, because the remaining one may develop the king of the hill syndrome and become a terror towards your tank mates.

Both the Koran and the gold rim tang will eventually outgrow the 72bow, but depending on their size, you probably have a bit of time. I'm wondering if your friend got all these fish from Skiptons.

The tank also came with an Emperor 400 power filter. I added a 403 Fluval canister filter after I bought the tank and have just installed a sump/pump with overflow 2 weeks ago. I am not sure how soon to start using a Protein Skimmer and whether I need power head to increase the water flow, especially under the live rocks. Some people also said live sand is better than crushed coral...

Next thing, ditch the canister filters. The short story is that they are superfluous. You really want a protein skimmer ASAP, especially with that many fish. not to get too technical, but a protein skimmer removes the waste before it can degrade, while a canister filter converts the waste to nitrate, but can't get rid of the nitrate. Canister filters have all but been superseded in the hobby. I would invest in a decent sized and quality skimmer ASAP. Do not disconnect the canister filters right away. Rather, run the filters with the skimmer for 4 weeks, and then start slowly removing the media from the filters over 8 weeks. Once all their media has been discarded disconnect the filters.

Your flow should be okay if the water surface is rippled. It depends on what, if any, coral you want to grow in there. You shouldn't need flow under the rocks. The general consensus is that sand is much better in a reef tank than crushed coral because it fosters more life helpful to maintaining your tank. However, some people use crushed coral or even no substrate at all. Crushed coral will be easier to clean in the mean time while you're getting that bioload under control.

If you implement these two simple measures (get rid of the damsels and phase in a protein skimmer) you will see a dramatic increase in the health of your reef and your fish.

Matt

 

[merk1_99]

Also let your tank mature when it is running. Don't run out and load it with corals and fish. Think of it as 12-18 month stocking plan....Patience, and the proper tank equipment maintenenace are key to sucess in the hobby.

 

[rich]

Welcome

Welcome to the BRS check out the equipment section here there were some skimmers for sale used which could save either one of you some money, if they have been sold I would buy a new one online the markup at your lfs is high. If possible I would remove all the damsels now, I have three and would love to remove them if I could(they hide inside holes in my liverock). And you need to change 100% of your carbon every three weeks or it will release what it cleans out of the water back. Only changing part of the carbon is a fresh water thing I think.

 

[Gina McReeferson]

If possible I would remove all the damsels now, I have three and would love to remove them if I could(they hide inside holes in my liverock)

I agree with Matt and Rich on the the damsels. In my opinion, they are aggressive towards other fish and very hard to get out, especially when you have nine of them. They were great as starter fish, but after that they were just a nuissance.

-Gina

 

[NateHanson]

ok thanks. this is gonna be a stupid question (for you pros lol), but what exactly does a skimmer do?

Welcome to the BRS, and good luck with the new tank! The boys at AquaAddicts and the members of this club will be a great resource as you get started.

For more information about how skimmers work, what the different kinds are, pros, cons, etc, look at this "Useful Threads" sticky (at the top of the reef talk forum). http://www.bostonreefers.org/forums/showthread.php?t=5034 Many particularly useful discussions are archived there for folks just like you to review. One of the threads there is all about skimmers. Another is about sumps. And the list goes on and on. Definitely worth a little visit.

Again, Welcome to the club, and don't hesitate to ask questions!

Nate

 

[~Silly~Spy]

thanks for all the answers and support guys, i can tell this is a great community here! i will make a post in a couple of weeks once i get everything situated. i have actually already been to aqua addicts. my friend told me that they sell huge plecos there. i went there and they dont carry a single freshwater fish lol. i talked to the guy for like 15mins about salt water tanks, thats kinda how i got interested in starting a reef tank.

i have 2 more quick questions.
is a deeper tank better for reef tanks? like instead of a 20L, i use a 29. because i have an extra 29 that im not using.

and second, do you need to cycle salt water tanks? i have alot of fresh water tanks just wondering if its the same process to cycle a salt tank.

 

[JohnK]

Shallower is arguably better for reef tanks because you get better light penetration / intensity.

Yes, saltwater tanks cycle just like FW. That said, if you add cured liverock you will move through the cycling process very quickly as the rock will have all the needed bacteria, it will just have to multiply. (LR also goes through some die off, especially if it's not cured, or isn't fully cured.)

A related factor that is different is that with SW/reef tanks you can acheive effective de-nitrification unlike FW tanks. The inner nooks and crannies in the liverock, and the lower zones of deep sand beds make for low O2 conditions that allow de-nitrifying bacteria to process the nitrate that would otherwise accumulate. Most / many reef tanks consistently run 0 nitrate.

Also, one other thought. If your going to set up your tank with a sump, you have two options for the drain. You can use a comerically available add on overflow box (relies on siphon, more expensive, ugly, unreliable, potential to cause a serious flood), or have the tank drilled and install a proper internal overflow box (cheaper, no siphon to rely on, no flooding to worry about). If you do decide you want to go the latter route, it's far far easier to drill the tank before setting it up. If you want to do that there are many BRS people, myself included, that can drill a tank for you and help build and install a internal overflow box.

 

[jovreef]

Welcome to the club! WOW so many new people super!

As far as your question on depth of the tank... The intensity of light that penatrates the tank water decreases as it gets deeper in the tank. SO a shallower tank such as a 20L will be able to have more light loving corals lower in the tank, where a 29 will not be able to have the same corals so deep. Dont worry though, there are plenty of very beautiful lower light corals that can fill the bottom half of your 29

Personally, if your a person who is not very hands on and forgets to top off water, do water changes or dose a small tank, they can be difficult to keep. I however have kept on top of my small 20 gallon tank and have had no problems with it. I had a 20 for 2 years, upgraded, downgraded to a 10 gallon for a year and upgraded again a year ago to a 20 again. I top off my water daily & dose my tank daily! I only do water changed every 2-3 weeks though. and I've NEVER had a single problem *knock on wood* I find the nano tank just as easy as a bigger tank.

For skimmer I'd reccomend a Coralife Super skimmer! its an awsome skimmer & super cheap!!!! I paid I think $80 for mine. Its rated for up to 65 gallons. It can hang on the back of the tank or go in the sump. It can be fussy for about the first week and a major pain in the arse! but after that first break in week its been a dream!

 

[Sunni]

Hello.

Everyone was new at one point. We all remember what it was like.
Oh my goodness!!! Okay, one of the most unbending tenets in saltwater aquariums is that you can regrettably only have a limited number of fish in a tank of a given size. This is what is called your stocking limit. You may also hear the term stocking density. Your friend, while possibly meaning well, put way, way, way too many fish in a 72gal bowfront!....
.............
Matt

You are such a perceptive, funny guy, aren't you, Matt? Remind me of someone I know.... oh, me!
Thanks for the wonderful and detailed info. I feel like I have a LOT of homework to do.... So, let me get started with reading your awesome info! Thanks again.

 

[Sunni]

I would like to apologize to ~Silly~Spy for "intruding" on her post! I was new to this and still am not quite familiar with the Forumn process. I later reposted my "New to the Sea" to Reef Talk and thanks to all who replied and provided great answers to my questions.

Thank you, ~Silly~Spy, for your patience. Hopefully, in the near future, I get to visit your post for the right reasons!

 

[Ultramarine]

Hi and welcome!

Forgive me if you've already done this, but I found the most important equipment to have with SW/reef tanks are books! Especially if you're brand new and/or switching over from FW. I switched over from FW a few years ago. I tried a reef tank and my results were not the greatest. Now I'm starting over again and have read a bunch of books and lurked on reef forums and I've learned so much! My new tank is doing so much better than my old one ever did! And asking questions of the wonderful people here is excellent, too. You can do it! You need a ton of patience (and money). You'll have successes and failures (and spend alot of money). But you can do it and it's so worth it!