LED discussion: split from Taotronics-or-Reefbreeders-LED

[saltwaterB]

Yes but Archit, you don't keep Corals long term. Your objective is to have them look as good as possible so they sell fast...so LED is the obvious choice for any online store...

and you have not been in the hobby for really all that long, so you don't have the years of experience using almost every other type of lighting as a reference...

That is also a big part of why you see old school hobbyist swear off LED and newer Hobbyist swear by them...it is just a matter of experience and opinion...
Now that more and more research and development is being done we are getting closer an closer to the right thing...but unfortunately it takes time to work out the kinks...as many of the posts point out we are light years ahead of the "PFO" led that started the whole thing..and it will only continue to get better and better. AS I am sure you will see even newer and affordable fixtures coming in over the next few months to years...and I can't wait to get my hands on them...lol
Just keep any eye out over the next few months for a brand new very special LED fixture coming on the market...

 

[saltwaterB]

so in a short period of time I assume? I have been running almost 2 years with Vega Led and having awesome results. I'm just curious if any of these tank crashes were short term. Thanks

all were within the first three years....some within 6 months to a year...but most are the 2-3 year point....

and they were not tank crashes....just loss of corals, and when lighting was switched back to T5 or MH things got better...this is the case for over 40-50 tanks of customers that I have talked to in the last few years...and this is with a multitude of different LED units...

 

[Marshall O]

Yes, as you mention the key is the LED themselves and how they are driven...
Most of the Whites on the market are not needed and kill most LPS Corals...while yes, they do keep SPS alive...but in the long term are they giving the Coral what is needs for good health...NO

B - Really the only thing I disagree with you on is where you state that the white LEDs kill LPS. I have several LPS (Euphyllia, Duncans, Acans, Candy Cane, Fungia, Trachyphyllia radiata, Favia, Chalices) that had only been lit by "white and blue" LEDs going on over a year now and all have grown quite well (subjectable, I know) and the colors look just as good as the day I got them (again subjectable). But I am only one person, and I am sure you have seen and heard many more stories either good or bad.

What I will agree with you is that there is no beating some of the high end fixtures that mix lighting technologies. If it comes to a point where my fixtures are causing a decline in my corals, you can bet I will be next in line to get such a fixture.

 

[higorc]

LEDreef....don't even get me started on this one...this proves absolutely no success with LED lights "longterm" at all...he changes his setup and sprinkles Brazilian fairy reef dust in his tank on a regular basis...if this is your proof....NEXT!....lol

Not sure what he does but I can assure u, there are missing pieces to this puzzle. I'm Brazilian and if there was any sort of "Brazilian Fairy Dust" to sprinkle over Reef tanks, I would be all over it and having my Grandmother send it to me from Brazil!

Nah, I go through headaches and trial and error just like everyone here... I like to think I'm a successful Reefer but I struggle every once in a while with common headaches that afflicts this hobby.

I currently run LED/T5s combo with good results, but I'm all for LEDs and have been waiting for a while to feel confident enough to switch to an "All LED" set up. I honestly think I'm getting more confidence from the latest LEDs fixture and will finally be doing the switch pretty soon.

B, I saw ur thank last time I was over with the Pacific Suns (with no whites!) and my jaw dropped! Colors were amazing! It got me thinking how come I can't get my colors to pop like that .


I have be doing a lot of research on light fixtures, and will be swapping soon... IMO second to flow patterns in a Reef Tank, lighting is the next most important thing .

Higor

 

[saltwaterB]

well you are one of the lucky ones...cause if you read the forums and talk to hundreds of people you will here the exact opposite...
mostly with Acans, Trachys, Chalice, and Euphyllias..
They seem great in short term for SPS and Zoas...
And we all know there are a million other variables that can affect things, that will only be compounded by things like lighting...
so most are assumptions as to what is causing the real issues anyways...but the most common variable seems to be envelope style white LEDs...

and as we have discussed it really depends on the LED's themselves...and the Corals one is trying to keep happy
As I mentioned this is more broad based response and not any particular units in general...just 90% of the LED's that have been on the market for years.

 

[saltwaterB]

Higor,

That's right...no white LEDs and 4 T5 bulbs (2 blue plus and 2 Coral plus) that Pacific Sun is the only LED fixture that "I" will us over my personal stuff that is for sure...and that is a VERY nutrient rich tank....I have 27 fish in a 70 gallon tank...and feed them 5 times a day.
But if you notice...I have NO LED's over any other tanks in the shop...(besides Bijan's Radion) Maybe in a year or two, when I am confident that this is really "the" light, then I will outfit the store with them.

 

[Marshall O]

FWIW, I am a huge fan of that Pacific Sun fixture too B. All colors POP and it is obviously doing the tank very well. That is actually the best display tank I have seen at any LFS. Of course having higher end wrasses in there helps too

 

[saltcrazy]

Wow good to know. If I lost all of my corals I would consider it some sort of tank crash lol. I understand what you mean tho. I would like to come up and see your place too I hear good things

 

[LoveTheReef]

Yes but Archit, you don't keep Corals long term. Your objective is to have them look as good as possible so they sell fast...so LED is the obvious choice for any online store...

and you have not been in the hobby for really all that long, so you don't have the years of experience using almost every other type of lighting as a reference...

That is also a big part of why you see old school hobbyist swear off LED and newer Hobbyist swear by them...it is just a matter of experience and opinion...
Now that more and more research and development is being done we are getting closer an closer to the right thing...but unfortunately it takes time to work out the kinks...as many of the posts point out we are light years ahead of the "PFO" led that started the whole thing..and it will only continue to get better and better. AS I am sure you will see even newer and affordable fixtures coming in over the next few months to years...and I can't wait to get my hands on them...lol
Just keep any eye out over the next few months for a brand new very special LED fixture coming on the market...

Quite to the contrary B -- we don't sell corals within the first 2-3 weeks of receiving them; and usually wait 2-3 months to make sure they are healthy and well

We're not a regular "shop" -- our goal is to acclimatize corals to LEDs. There have been many mis-conceptions about our "policies" and what we "do" and where we stand.

Being a "real shop" as you like to call it, you guys have a much faster turn over than me -- so making corals look good would be a higher priority for you. The simple fact is, it takes times to properly acclimate corals to LEDs because they do lose their color short term, and regain it back, and we wait for them to regain them back. Majority of our stock has been cooking here for over 5 months.

If you need any clarifications on our business model, please ask instead of assuming.

I rather not pick a fight or call out a "store" on public forums, so if you need to discuss successes and failures, please feel free to PM me.

 

[RiverRat]

I have the Pacific Sun with no T5 (Hyperion S)......
I will have to start making a log or something to show progress through time.
So far, I am very pleased with growth and health (as well as color, but that is clearly seen with one look ). I keep LPS (Trachy, Acan, Hammer, Frogspawn, etc.) and Zoas.
Stay tuned.....

 

[lex_lutha111384]

Check out the led experiment on vivid aquariums tv.

 

[jt628]

That is also a big part of why you see old school hobbyist swear off LED and newer Hobbyist swear by them...it is just a matter of experience and opinion...

well said my friend

 

[jdeb101]

Please excuse my ignorance, but what exactly do corals need from light to live a long healthy life? I was always under the impression it was all about par par par.

 

[saltwaterB]

no no no...way more than just par...useable spectrums aid in photosynthesis, and incorrect ones will yield nothing...or cause damage

 

[dz6t]

To the OP, I used to owned several Taotronic LED, all of them had issue with fans, all of them rust within several month, one of them developed a problem with one of the powercord socket.

 

[saltcrazy]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jgkPxWogmEg

 

[dz6t]

our goal is to acclimatize corals to LEDs. .

I did talked to experts in marine biology in a top university in the world because I am very curious about this claim. All of them are wondering about where the scientific basis of such claim came from. Can you please provide some reference because they don't think it is remotely possible. sorry for the OT post.Thanks

 

[LoveTheReef]

I did talked to experts in marine biology in a top university in the world because I am very curious about this claim. All of them are wondering about where the scientific basis of such claim came from. Can you please provide some reference because they don't think it is remotely possible. sorry for the OT post.Thanks

Yes, led light is more intense than t5s and the acclimating needs to be slow, or the corals can go in a shock and go through morphing, recession, bleaching, or a combination of. This is especially more true for fixtures with lens because all that energy is focused directly down with lens.

When acclimating corals to leds (especially acans, chalices etc), you need to start them out at lower light level, and slowly bring them up.

As for sources, this is from experience as well as the multitude of people with success stories under leds. (I can find the sources if you wish when I am at a computer)

In our experience, corals are very hardy as long as you don't put them through drastic changes.

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk

 

[dz6t]

I may misunderstood your claim, does your process can induce permanent change in the corals that will allow them LED-friendly?

 

[LoveTheReef]

I did talked to experts in marine biology in a top university in the world because I am very curious about this claim. All of them are wondering about where the scientific basis of such claim came from. Can you please provide some reference because they don't think it is remotely possible. sorry for the OT post.Thanks

Hope you don't mind the barrage of links

http://www.ecoxotic.com/community/aquarium-lighting/acclimating-your-corals-to-led-lights
http://blog.reefgeek.com/2013/05/acclimating-corals-to-led-lights.html
http://www.reef2reef.com/forums/led-lighting-specific/62408-acclimating-corals-leds-help.html
http://www.bostonreefers.org/forums/showthread.php?118498-New-LED-lights-coral-acclimation
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2305904
http://forums.saltwaterfish.com/t/383190/going-from-pcs-to-leds-should-i-acclimate-the-coral
http://www.reefsanctuary.com/forums...nearly-killed-off-my-corals-led-addition.html
http://www.njreefers.org/showthread.php?77808-Acclimating-corals-to-led-s
http://www.livingreefs.com/threads/acclimating-corals-to-new-lights.38281/


This was just the first page from google with you search for "acclimating corals to leds" ( http://lmgtfy.com/?q=acclimating+corals+to+leds )

Basically thing to remember, is that temporary low light will not kill the coral (it'll make it brown out), but excessive light will make the coral bleach. Also please remember, with LEDs, even though the tank might not look as bright to the human eye, the corals will feel otherwise That one I can probably find more scientific evidence for but will have to look around again for the article I read last time.

Please PM me or start a new thread under our forum if you have any other questions about LEDs that I might be able to answer.