Question on Mandarin/Dragonet Feeding

madducks42

Resident Nihilist
BRS Member
We have two dragonets in our 90 gallon tank, a Ruby Red and a Red Scooter. When we bought them the LFS said they were eating frozen brine shrimp, which they sort of are but I don't think they're eating enough of it. Once again my bad for not doing the research before picking up a new fish. I thought they would be easier to take care of than mandarins, which we'd also like to get someday, but from the reading I've done the last few days it sounds like these guys also need a stable supply of copepods to thrive. So now I'm trying to decide what the best path forward is.

I kind of like the idea of having a refugium and growing copepods but I'm concerned that we don't have room for one. These have come up several times in some of the threads I've been reading - https://www.bulkreefsupply.com/larg...-refugium-with-led-lighting-cpr-aquatics.html - but it seems like that wouldn't be big enough. Even the large size is only 5 gallons. From other articles I've read it sounds like bigger is better and the general rule is at least 10% the size of your tank. We have a 20 gallon sump but there isn't a lot of space in it.

Other options seem to be just ordering copepods 1-2 times a month and just dumping them in the display tank. Or getting the above refugium and regularly ordering copepods to replenish it since I don't think we could grow enough copepods to keep two scooters and a future mandarin happy.

Anyone here have any scooters or mandarins? If so, what do you feed them?
 
You can try feeding something like nutramar ova or oyster eggs, something small like that. Otherwise your best bet is just to build out a decent size refugium and run chaeto. I try to feed them live foods to start and slowly swap in frozen
 
You could go old school and just make a pile of ruble or more in your display for the pods to hide in
 
We have two dragonets in our 90 gallon tank, a Ruby Red and a Red Scooter. When we bought them the LFS said they were eating frozen brine shrimp, which they sort of are but I don't think they're eating enough of it. Once again my bad for not doing the research before picking up a new fish. I thought they would be easier to take care of than mandarins, which we'd also like to get someday, but from the reading I've done the last few days it sounds like these guys also need a stable supply of copepods to thrive. So now I'm trying to decide what the best path forward is.

I kind of like the idea of having a refugium and growing copepods but I'm concerned that we don't have room for one. These have come up several times in some of the threads I've been reading - https://www.bulkreefsupply.com/larg...-refugium-with-led-lighting-cpr-aquatics.html - but it seems like that wouldn't be big enough. Even the large size is only 5 gallons. From other articles I've read it sounds like bigger is better and the general rule is at least 10% the size of your tank. We have a 20 gallon sump but there isn't a lot of space in it.

Other options seem to be just ordering copepods 1-2 times a month and just dumping them in the display tank. Or getting the above refugium and regularly ordering copepods to replenish it since I don't think we could grow enough copepods to keep two scooters and a future mandarin happy.

Anyone here have any scooters or mandarins? If so, what do you feed them?
I have done crazy research on both fish i too made the mistake that almost cost me my ruby red dragonet he got scrawny but is now plumping up very well! How i did this was i bought a 30$ bag of copepods from algaebarn online came real fast like 2 days cut holes in a Rubbermaid container and gave it a decent vent but nothing crazy put some chaeto in it then i allowed the pods to acclimate temp wise 10 min then with my turkey baster i started slowly squirting pods into my copepod motel! I recommend taking out any filter socks or cutting off your filtration and heads completely so the pods have a chance to settle for atleast a hour. I did this cause i don't use a refugium and my pod population couldn't establish this was a helpful way to get out started!Another way I'm trying now cause i don't want this eye sore in my tank anymore is i got a small glass bottle and i soak mysis and brine shrimp in garlic then slowly lower the bottle down with shrimp in it my mandarin is starting to eat frozen foods now I'm just giving him more time to adjust but it's easy these worked for me good luck!

Ps my mandarin and ruby red dragonet hang by this often it's cool to watch
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I've got a scooter blenny. What I did was make a feeding tube that went down to an inverted piece of Tupperware. It allows the food to get down to the substrate unmolested. I feed mine Frozen blood worms brine mysis and sinking pellets. It took a while but my Flame hawkfish and Starry blenny have also figured out where the food is.
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Eventually I'll change out that PVC for some nice black ABS pipe.
 
After some discussions over lunch (because 50% of the conversations between me and my boyfriend are now about the reef tank, lol) we decided to use part of the sump to hopefully cultivate some copepods. I suspect we'll have to order them on a regular basis to boost the population but that's fine. I ordered a bunch of copepods off algae barn and we should have them by the weekend. @CJRIZZOTTI thanks for the idea! I'll probably do something similar for our tank. I'm sure some of them will get sucked up through the return pump and make it to the display tank but I'm also going to seed the display tank directly for a while because I suspect the two scooters in the tank are hungry : )

I do need to pick up some chaeto at some point, hoping someone brings some to the meeting this weekend.
 
After some discussions over lunch (because 50% of the conversations between me and my boyfriend are now about the reef tank, lol) we decided to use part of the sump to hopefully cultivate some copepods. I suspect we'll have to order them on a regular basis to boost the population but that's fine. I ordered a bunch of copepods off algae barn and we should have them by the weekend. @CJRIZZOTTI thanks for the idea! I'll probably do something similar for our tank. I'm sure some of them will get sucked up through the return pump and make it to the display tank but I'm also going to seed the display tank directly for a while because I suspect the two scooters in the tank are hungry : )

I do need to pick up some chaeto at some point, hoping someone brings some to the meeting this weekend.
SAVE YOUR MONEY! Pour half in a small tank or bucket culturing your own copepods is so easy this helped me use a this method but with a 20 gallon tank my pods are exploding almost ready to harvest after only 2 weeks there are a bunch of easy ways to culture copepods YouTube it

http://www.brineshrimpdirect.com/c90/raising-live-rotifers-copepods-c199.html

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I'm hoping that we can sustain a population in the sump. I bought some of the marine pure bio filters from Algae Barn along with the copepods. So I'm hoping that between that and the chaeto that most of them will stay in the sump and then I can just rotate the bio filters in and out of the display tank and sump. If that doesn't work then I'll probably use one the spare 10 gallon tanks around the house and see if I can sustain a population in there. But the sump approach will be easier.
 
I'm hoping that we can sustain a population in the sump. I bought some of the marine pure bio filters from Algae Barn along with the copepods. So I'm hoping that between that and the chaeto that most of them will stay in the sump and then I can just rotate the bio filters in and out of the display tank and sump. If that doesn't work then I'll probably use one the spare 10 gallon tanks around the house and see if I can sustain a population in there. But the sump approach will be easier.
Might wanna Try dumping half a bag in to culture copepods in the 10 gal just as a fail safe takes about 2 weeks as long as you have a few bubbles going and phyto in the water they'll reproduce but regardless good luck and happy reefing

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Small update. I'm having mixed success so far. I did an order from algae barn and got 2 packs of copepods, one was their mix that had three different types and then an additional bag of the tisbe ones since those seem to be more recommended for dragonets. I also got some of their "Ocean Magick" stuff which is just a mix of different types of phytoplankton. I put about half of each copepod bag into the display tank and the other half into a bucket downstairs. I definitely saw our little Ruby Red scooter picking at things on the rock so I'm assuming he was finding them in the display tank. But it's been well over a week now and it seemed like he was getting a little sluggish and looked skinny. He was really easy to catch so I put him in a little net box, still in the display tank, and put some chaeto and rock from the bucket downstairs in there with him. I've been switching out the chaeto and rock between his little net home and the bucket downstairs. I see him occasionally pick at things so I think he's finding stuff to eat. But I don't see anything, lol. I know they're really hard to see but how the hell do you tell if you're being successful in cultivating them? I can see some small white dots floating around in the water column so I think there are some in the thank, but it's my understanding that the tisbe variety don't swim and tend to stick to the sand or live rock which is why they're preferred for dragonets. I've been adding their recommended dosage of the Ocean Magick stuff to the tank every day, that's going to get expensive fast, lol. So I'm checking out other options for that and for feeding the ones in the bucket downstairs.
 
Small update. I'm having mixed success so far. I did an order from algae barn and got 2 packs of copepods, one was their mix that had three different types and then an additional bag of the tisbe ones since those seem to be more recommended for dragonets. I also got some of their "Ocean Magick" stuff which is just a mix of different types of phytoplankton. I put about half of each copepod bag into the display tank and the other half into a bucket downstairs. I definitely saw our little Ruby Red scooter picking at things on the rock so I'm assuming he was finding them in the display tank. But it's been well over a week now and it seemed like he was getting a little sluggish and looked skinny. He was really easy to catch so I put him in a little net box, still in the display tank, and put some chaeto and rock from the bucket downstairs in there with him. I've been switching out the chaeto and rock between his little net home and the bucket downstairs. I see him occasionally pick at things so I think he's finding stuff to eat. But I don't see anything, lol. I know they're really hard to see but how the hell do you tell if you're being successful in cultivating them? I can see some small white dots floating around in the water column so I think there are some in the thank, but it's my understanding that the tisbe variety don't swim and tend to stick to the sand or live rock which is why they're preferred for dragonets. I've been adding their recommended dosage of the Ocean Magick stuff to the tank every day, that's going to get expensive fast, lol. So I'm checking out other options for that and for feeding the ones in the bucket downstairs.
Do you have a refugium?

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Have you tried frozen brine or live blackworms? My scooter gobbles them both right up. PE Calanus is another good one.

I feed frozen brine shrimp to most of the fish and this little guy doesn't show much of an interest in it. I'll see him occasionally grab a piece but I don't think he's getting nearly enough to sustain himself. I was going to pick up some bloodworms next time I was at a fish store to see if he has any interest in that. Eventually we would like to get a a mandarin though so I'd really like to get a copepod population going.

Do you have a refugium?

We don't have a refugium but we are planning on putting chaeto in the sump, it's going to go in the last chamber right before the return pump. We need to tweak a few things so that the chaeto won't get sucked into the pump. Hoping to get that done in the next few days.
 
I feed frozen brine shrimp to most of the fish and this little guy doesn't show much of an interest in it. I'll see him occasionally grab a piece but I don't think he's getting nearly enough to sustain himself. I was going to pick up some bloodworms next time I was at a fish store to see if he has any interest in that. Eventually we would like to get a a mandarin though so I'd really like to get a copepod population going.



We don't have a refugium but we are planning on putting chaeto in the sump, it's going to go in the last chamber right before the return pump. We need to tweak a few things so that the chaeto won't get sucked into the pump. Hoping to get that done in the next few days.
I don't have a refugium and was having trouble getting my copepod population to stabilize so i cut slits in a Rubbermaid bowl put some cheato and within 10 days my population was booming and has been ever since! I call it the copepod motel it gives them a safe place to get it on and reproduce before getting eaten off! Good luck
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If you’re using the cheato just for pods and not nutrient export, you could use a loofa( yes what u shower/bath with) instead. It’ll keep the population growing and no mess. You can even shake it in the dt and release a few every once in a while
 
I have a sump but cant figure out where I could create a refugium b/c no space? I have my return... with a skimmer then I have a small space that could hold a filter pad.. then I have my return. If I placed a loofa where the filter pad could be and insert pods is that all I need to do? I have stayed away from the chaeto in my sump b/c I cant figure out how it will not clog my return pump? What do you feed the pods anything? I have a mandarin... 2 years in a 90 gallon tank. He used to be fatter...
 
They eat phytoplankton and ditris
I’ve never fed them anything special and have a lot roaming my tank. I do feed heavy though
 
Chaeto is in the sump! Stopped by Love The Reef yesterday and picked up some corals and snails. I was going to get some silicone so we could put in another divider in the sump for the chaeto but they recommended this little plastic acclimation box instead. So much easier than draining the sump and leaving the return pump off while it dried.

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Make a feeder like this one and hatch brine shrimp to put in it every day. These ruby reds, mandarins, scooter bleenies and pipefish are all spawning and have been for years.



Hi Paul
Is there a thread somewhere where you explain how to make such a feeder? I have a mandarin that was doing great a year ago but now seems be struggling to compete as my tank gets more populated. Your feeder design looks very interesting. Is it a modified Petri dish with a mesh top? Am particularly interested in mesh size. Thanks so much!


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