If you could advise a shop on how to improve....would you?

[marco67]

Just to clarify;
"Marcs" comments were not only regarding Marcs store, but numbers I've seen and heard mentioned from your stores that "count" also. They are also numbers that anyone across the country that has any retail experience will and has confirmed.
Not to slight any of our members (we have some very talented reef keepers for sure) but designing and stocking a system for retail use is a total different animal than installing and maintaining a "closed" system.
I know this is all well intended and I get the Privacy thing, but I still think it's a slippery slope. Presentation would be critical, as would careful consideration of the content of the critique. I just feel there would be to much potential to give the club a reputation of arrogance, and in the end what's there to gain?

 

[dave601m]

I know if I ran an LFS, or any locail retail business for that matter, I would consistently be open to suggestions about ways to improve. People may make the argument that only 5-10% of the business comes from clubs, but maybe if a few changes were made, they would get more business from the clubs. I'm not in the fish business so I may be completely wrong, but it won't cost anyone anything, and with it being voluntary for the store to participate and non-publuc, how can it possibly hurt? if the store doesn't like the suggestion someone makes, they can just delete it.

 

[Greg Hiller]

>in the end what's there to gain?<

Possibly reduction of needless cruelty towards some organisms. Possibly less harvesting of critters that have near zero % chance of survival. Possibly improvements in a store's customer service, appearance, and success.

 

[nitrofish]

Maybe we should just suggest that interested stores set up suggestion boxes


I agree. maybe some stores just don't wan't to hear the comments, and those who do could just leave a suggestion box.

 

[rjdudek]

I guess I am a bit slow to catch on here, but I cannot believe any business person would not instantly jump on the opportunity to have a free feedback / customer suggestion poll done with their repeat customer base. Successful business routinely poll less than 5% of their customers and make process changes based on that subset. I never expected there to be a down side to the question “how can I do a better job for you next time”. I guess a business run under the emotional limitations of its owner might become upset by feedback from experts (each of us is the foremost expert on our perspective of our experiences), but these business will not participate in a voluntary program that might demonstrate they are not perfect.

Suggestion boxes are a black hole into another universe. Managers open them like clockwork until they see the suggestions come in at a rate of one per career.

 

[delta]

I would have to agree with Marc and Scott it is not a good idea.

My feeling in this is why would a store entertain comments from a group such as ours when our main thing is getting a better deal despite shop loyalty?
It is one thing to approach a store you shop at and know the people who work there. Possibly mentioning some thing in passing or just engaging in chit chat making your hobby practices know. This I could see.

However I don't think we should take the Higher than now additude to tell businesses how to run. I don't really think it will go over well to say you need to do "X" but I still want the best deal in town.

If they change there business practices will you do more business with them
paying full price to account for any increases in running costs? There has to be an up side for them. I am willing to bet they won't see the up side to this.

 

[GinaD]

Not picking on anyone...but:

Just for kicks I counted up the number of times I said 'private' in so many words. The first was in the 1st post:

'Information would not be revealed publically'

then in a later post:

'There would be no thread. As I mentioned, the comments would be delivered directly to the shops.'

Then again:

'If it's all private, what difference does it make? '

It's amazing how people just do not read. This is how so many misunderstanding occur on this board. People get all bent out of shape about something when they didn't understand what was written in the first place.

Greg,
You are the one who seems to be getting bent out of shape here. I wasn't getting bent out of shape! Just because I read your thread quickly and missed the word 'private' doesn't mean I'm stupid. Your response top my post is a bit overblown, don't you think??

 

[Tstone]

don't fool yourself into thinking the club makes up most of the LFS biz.
Quite frankly that a joke to think it?s true.

Not to be overly harsh on the BRS spending habits as a whole, but.......

there certainly are a lot of BRS 'lookers" at the LFS who go to chat it up, maybe have a drink or two, but they are not the ones spending 20K on a new setup. They are not the ones buying maint. /service agreements at $400 a month. They are not the ones buying the pumps and dry goods at sticker prices.

In fact most of them complain publicly that the LFS price is higher than online/ebay and often spend enormous amounts of time trying to find an angle to get a better deal. Most even complain that the price to buy something (reasonably priced or not) can be DIY made at a much lower cost , and who would pay such high prices.....
I have often heard other LFS (INCLUDING sponsors) refer to the BRS as the Boston cheapers rather than the Boston reefers.

And why doesn't marc count? Because he was far away? Does that mean CRA doesn't apply to those members in NH because he's too far away? How the heck does that make any sense? Now the BOD is measuring inaccessibility? NICE. that must really suck for those online vendors like champion or people like Farmer john in CT. nice to know they don't count.



As far as the BRS making suggestions to LFS.... I can't believe this thread is for real....
the concept of constructive criticism to a store might be well received on an individual level as most stores listen to their returning customers, but to have an online group walk in with a "you suck and this is why" statement (regardless on how you word it) is only going to further distance the BRS from any future sponsorship.

Maybe Jeremy is onto something with the one cup system...

As a former sponser and someone who has done a ton of business with the BRS members I have to agree with Scott here.

Nothing directed at Rich just agree with the general statment.

 

[Tstone]

Greg I think this idea is like xenia. Great at first but then it becomes a weed.

 

[GinaD]

I think this whole post is a bit too self-indulgent, if you ask me.

 

[billm]

Who cares if the stores like it,If we are such a small percentage of there biz why would they care?

 

[billm]

Frankly I'm tired of every body worrying about offending the lfs

 

[GinaD]

Just another reason that this is NOT a good idea.

 

[JohnK]

Gina - well put ("just another reason")

Marvin on the xenia reference- yea, well put also.

Bill - I get what you are saying too, but in the big picture do we want LFS's to welcome us and GIVE us discounts, or be annoyed by the mention of the BRS?

IMO, it's in the best interest of the club to have a positive relationship with the better LFS's.

My question is; will this idea help or hurt that goal? Like xenia, it sounds great to start, but the long term impact could be difficult?

 

[loru1588]

As a worker bee at a LFS I think the best approach could be suggestions on the variety of live stock and dry goods. What should we carry what should we NOT suggest for reef tanks ?

Once someone crosses the line into telling somebody how to run their business the defense shields go up and it becomes an uphill fight even if the suggestions may be valid.

The average aquarist has no idea of the overhead involved in running a shop so price issues should be left out. Keep the suggestions to the salable items. "You should always try to stock emerald crabs because they are a staple in reef maintenance" for example.

This is a finite community and it's best to tread lightly in both directions.

My 2 pence,

Dan

 

[sw300galma]

The average aquarist has no idea of the overhead involved in running a shop so price issues should be left out.

Dan although i agree with you mostly...I would say that since you are not able to look at every other LFSs prices you would alteast want to KNOW if you are in the ball park on prices. I work at a high performance shop owned by my friend...we can't keep up on every price for every part for every car ever made...so we take what our customers say and try to work with it. Sometimes we can't match it...but if we can come closer while still keeping above our margins we try to do so. In any products there is always built in "wiggle" room. The other thing is people aren't looking for you to Beat other prices...I know myself personally is willing to pay a bit more for convience...If I don't have to goto another LFS to pickup dry goods I'd be willing to pay a bit more for convienece...

I think it's what the market will drive...Like gas prices..as they creep up people will still drive...but once gas got to $3.50 ish, people stopped driving to the point where gas prices came back down to $3.00 range.

Also take into consideration that volume over making a home run off of every purchase too can work out better.

It might be good to take suggestions...If you get a ton of "your salt prices are crazy" then you might want to take a look into what you can do.

But again you do have to take things with a grain of salt lol pun intended

 

[Tstone]

This is a finite community and it's best to tread lightly in both directions. Dan

Best thing I have read yet

 

[Greg Hiller]

>You are the one who seems to be getting bent out of shape here. I wasn't getting bent out of shape! Just because I read your thread quickly and missed the word 'private' doesn't mean I'm stupid. Your response top my post is a bit overblown, don't you think??<

Guess I should have added some more smilieys in my response. I tried to specifically say I was not targeting anyone in particular with my message. I certainly never used any names or suggested anything about anyones intellect. My point only was that if someone misunderstands the question ('would you take the time to give suggestions to a shop privately?') then they might have a different response.

Interesting that the shop that did the best in the LFS poll looked at the results carefully, and seems interested in improving based on what they perceived as deficiencies.

http://www.bostonreefers.org/forums/showthread.php?t=27790

Part of the reason I was thinking of setting up a poll for feed back to shops was that when I was setting up the LFS poll, some people commented (privately) that it would be good to use the poll as a feedback to shops. It would have had to have been much longer and more complex to attempt to do that. I decided to just go with a short poll that I hoped folks would complete. Hence this thread to see if enough people would be interested in giving feed back to shops in another poll.

 

[GinaD]

Ok - no problem.