Parasitic Acro Flatworms Destroying my Tank
- Thread starter Chuck Spyropulos
- Start date
Moe_K
Stabbed by Foulke
Chuck Spyropulos
Non-member
Good Pix
Darren, your pix will defineitely help people id the eggs. I never can actually see the worms on the corals since they seem to blend in so well. I see the eggs but not the worms and the eggs look exactly like the ones in your picture. They are always located at the base of the acro on dead tissue only, ussually in the small space between the branches...it seems like they like the shade...or at least like the shade to lay their eggs.
I only see the worms when I turkey baste them off of the colonies. They look like little bits of raw scallop at least in color...sort of white with some transluscence. They are much bigger that the planaria and are quite flat with ripples on the edges, sorta like a nudibranch swimming. They have no forked tail as do the planaria.
Hope this helps.
Darren, your pix will defineitely help people id the eggs. I never can actually see the worms on the corals since they seem to blend in so well. I see the eggs but not the worms and the eggs look exactly like the ones in your picture. They are always located at the base of the acro on dead tissue only, ussually in the small space between the branches...it seems like they like the shade...or at least like the shade to lay their eggs.
I only see the worms when I turkey baste them off of the colonies. They look like little bits of raw scallop at least in color...sort of white with some transluscence. They are much bigger that the planaria and are quite flat with ripples on the edges, sorta like a nudibranch swimming. They have no forked tail as do the planaria.
Hope this helps.
One Eye said:
Chuck Spyropulos
Non-member
No
No, but maybe I will tsake a look again tonight.
No, but maybe I will tsake a look again tonight.
~Flighty~ said:
just read through the whole thread. It's funny to hear a couple of people talking about going FOWAnemone.
My SPS system was supposed to be my pride and joy but I keep having problems. Every time I'm sitting here stressing out about issues with the SPS tank I look at my softie / BTA tank that I haven't even tested for any single parameter in at least 6 months and it's thriving. Makes me think, why argue with success.
My last disaster was being away for a weekend in the summer and having my AC not restart after a short power outage, temp in both tanks up to about 87. lost several acros and that whole system was all stressed out. BTA tank was fine except that both anemone's split, lost nothing.
makes me think about what my ideal reef tank really is?
My SPS system was supposed to be my pride and joy but I keep having problems. Every time I'm sitting here stressing out about issues with the SPS tank I look at my softie / BTA tank that I haven't even tested for any single parameter in at least 6 months and it's thriving. Makes me think, why argue with success.
My last disaster was being away for a weekend in the summer and having my AC not restart after a short power outage, temp in both tanks up to about 87. lost several acros and that whole system was all stressed out. BTA tank was fine except that both anemone's split, lost nothing.
makes me think about what my ideal reef tank really is?
Chuck Spyropulos
Non-member
Quarantine Tank
Well, I fianlly got my QT at least halfway set up. I went to Sea Creatures and talked to my friend John, the owner and he sold me one of those wrasses mentioned in this thread (forgot the name). He is a really good looking fish but he has not eaten any worms yet.....this is to expected since he is getting used to the tank and tank mates.
I also got the following:
20 gallon long tank
25 Watt UV Sterilizer
Prizm hang on skimmer
circ pumps
heater
10,000K PC bulb for my PC fiuxture
Everything is ready to go. Tomorrow I will fill the QT with clean salt water separate from my system. Then I will go through eacfh and every frag from my frag tank. If there are eggs I will scrape them off. Then I will do a n iodine dip to knock of the worms, if any followed by a strong basting to further knock any worms off. So far my frag tank seems unaffected but I am not going to take any chances.
Then I will take small frags from the top of every colony in my display and put them through the same de-worming procedure stated above, mount them and put them in the QT. Hopefully this will yield clean frags separate from my main system that I will use to restock my tank if I lose everything.
In the meantime I will also continue to baste off the worms from the
infected colonies. I have 3 colonies infected, that I know of in my display: the prostrata, ora blue mille (weep, weep, and more weeping), and a Bali Aquaculture Colony (just a few worms on this one and no damage yet).
All of my fish love to eat these things and hopefully the new wrasse will help out too.
After my display corals stop bleaching and exhibit normal polyp extension, or after they are all dead I will wait a few months and then take the frags from the QT and replace or add to my colonies in the display tank. I will never really know if all of the worms are gone but telltale signs of worms include bleaching, bare areas on corals, and very little to no polyp extension.
Hopefully, some biologist or chemist will find a reef-safe kill agent since I believe that my infestation, Mike Accardi's, Darren's and anyone else's is just the tip of the iceberg.
Well, I fianlly got my QT at least halfway set up. I went to Sea Creatures and talked to my friend John, the owner and he sold me one of those wrasses mentioned in this thread (forgot the name). He is a really good looking fish but he has not eaten any worms yet.....this is to expected since he is getting used to the tank and tank mates.
I also got the following:
20 gallon long tank
25 Watt UV Sterilizer
Prizm hang on skimmer
circ pumps
heater
10,000K PC bulb for my PC fiuxture
Everything is ready to go. Tomorrow I will fill the QT with clean salt water separate from my system. Then I will go through eacfh and every frag from my frag tank. If there are eggs I will scrape them off. Then I will do a n iodine dip to knock of the worms, if any followed by a strong basting to further knock any worms off. So far my frag tank seems unaffected but I am not going to take any chances.
Then I will take small frags from the top of every colony in my display and put them through the same de-worming procedure stated above, mount them and put them in the QT. Hopefully this will yield clean frags separate from my main system that I will use to restock my tank if I lose everything.
In the meantime I will also continue to baste off the worms from the
infected colonies. I have 3 colonies infected, that I know of in my display: the prostrata, ora blue mille (weep, weep, and more weeping), and a Bali Aquaculture Colony (just a few worms on this one and no damage yet).
All of my fish love to eat these things and hopefully the new wrasse will help out too.
After my display corals stop bleaching and exhibit normal polyp extension, or after they are all dead I will wait a few months and then take the frags from the QT and replace or add to my colonies in the display tank. I will never really know if all of the worms are gone but telltale signs of worms include bleaching, bare areas on corals, and very little to no polyp extension.
Hopefully, some biologist or chemist will find a reef-safe kill agent since I believe that my infestation, Mike Accardi's, Darren's and anyone else's is just the tip of the iceberg.
Chuck Spyropulos
Non-member
Good Point Jim
Don't tempt me.....
I am seriously thinking that as a last resort, if all my acros die off, that I will no longer continue to keep acros or even sps corals, at least for a long, long time. Or at least until we can trust out sources for these animals.
Don't tempt me.....
I am seriously thinking that as a last resort, if all my acros die off, that I will no longer continue to keep acros or even sps corals, at least for a long, long time. Or at least until we can trust out sources for these animals.
jimmyj7090 said:
Chuck Spyropulos
Non-member
Great
Glad to hear that!
Glad to hear that!
PRTA79 said:
Chuck Spyropulos
Non-member
Cycle
It will be a sterile tank, no cycling necessary, no love rock, no fish = no ammonia = no NO3 = no N02....I hope !
Hey, if u r free tomorrow night, I could use your help
It will be a sterile tank, no cycling necessary, no love rock, no fish = no ammonia = no NO3 = no N02....I hope !
Hey, if u r free tomorrow night, I could use your help
denvig said:
Greg Hiller
BRS Moderator
Chuck,
Maybe you are using it for another purpose (didn't read the thread that carefully), but UV sterilizers usually don't work very well for macroscopic organisms, and also don't work particularly well unless the critters you are trying to kill have a planktonic stage (I don't know if the flatworms do).
Maybe you are using it for another purpose (didn't read the thread that carefully), but UV sterilizers usually don't work very well for macroscopic organisms, and also don't work particularly well unless the critters you are trying to kill have a planktonic stage (I don't know if the flatworms do).
Chuck Spyropulos
Non-member
Yes, Greg, think I'll return the UV Sterilizer. I thought maybe if the larvae are really small and the dwell time through the UV is long enough, it might kill some of the free swimming bastards that manage to get into my 20 gallon QT. Do you think that there is a chance this could be effective ? Just trying to fill all the bases.
Well my saga continues...Three definite colonies infected in my tank. However, they are quite heavily encrusted and they are some of my favorite colonies. Getting these out completely would mean breaking down my reef....I can not and will not do it. I am continuing with the turkey baster 2 or 3 times a day and each day less and less worms.
Most of my fish follow me around (or really the turkey baster) and wait for the worms to fly off the coral. The fish are eating these thinkgs like candy! The Hardwicke wrasse so far has shown no interest to pick off the worms from the corals but he is still a new addition and he is doing great other wise.
Tonight, I will move all my frags from th frag tank into the QT after careful inspection, eggs scraping (if necessary), worm removal (if necessary) and a dip in SeaChem Coral Disinfectant followed by a turkey baster blasting. Oh what fun!!!!!
Then I will take frags from all colonies in my display and do the same as above and put them in QT. Hopefully the QT will save some of my corals, should I have a total loss of acros.
Well my saga continues...Three definite colonies infected in my tank. However, they are quite heavily encrusted and they are some of my favorite colonies. Getting these out completely would mean breaking down my reef....I can not and will not do it. I am continuing with the turkey baster 2 or 3 times a day and each day less and less worms.
Most of my fish follow me around (or really the turkey baster) and wait for the worms to fly off the coral. The fish are eating these thinkgs like candy! The Hardwicke wrasse so far has shown no interest to pick off the worms from the corals but he is still a new addition and he is doing great other wise.
Tonight, I will move all my frags from th frag tank into the QT after careful inspection, eggs scraping (if necessary), worm removal (if necessary) and a dip in SeaChem Coral Disinfectant followed by a turkey baster blasting. Oh what fun!!!!!
Then I will take frags from all colonies in my display and do the same as above and put them in QT. Hopefully the QT will save some of my corals, should I have a total loss of acros.
Greg Hiller
BRS Moderator
>I thought maybe if the larvae are really small and the dwell time through the UV is long enough, it might kill some of the free swimming bastards that manage to get into my 20 gallon QT. Do you think that there is a chance this could be effective ? Just trying to fill all the bases.<
I agree, if they are small enough, and they spend enough time in a sterilizer of sufficient wattage they may be killed....or just have a really good tan!! OTOH, maybe they will mutate faster into a super duper flatworm (this is a joke, not likely to happen)!!
I agree, if they are small enough, and they spend enough time in a sterilizer of sufficient wattage they may be killed....or just have a really good tan!!
OTOH, maybe they will mutate faster into a super duper flatworm (this is a joke, not likely to happen)!!Chuck Spyropulos
Non-member
Flatworm Tan
LOL...you made me laugh....thanks I need it right now!
If the UV doesn't kill them maybe it will render useless their gonads, eggs,
or other reproductive faculties..... Probably not but wouldn't that be great, no more eggs!
LOL...you made me laugh....thanks I need it right now!
If the UV doesn't kill them maybe it will render useless their gonads, eggs,
or other reproductive faculties.....
Probably not but wouldn't that be great, no more eggs! Greg Hiller said:I agree, if they are small enough, and they spend enough time in a sterilizer of sufficient wattage they may be killed....or just have a really good tan!!
Chuck Spyropulos
Non-member
Flatworms: Some Good News!
When I got home after work yesterday, I noticed my Goldflake Angel, Copperband Butterfly and to a smaller extent the Hardwicke wrasse all spending time under the branches of my affected corals and actually picking stuff off them. These fish have never exhibited this behavior in the past. Only when I started turkey basting did these fish sort of "learn" to hunt for the flatworms. When turkey basting the GF and CBB fight with each other to get into position under the corals to catch the flatworms as they blow off!
Each day there are less and less worms. However Dennis and I decided to pull out my Prostarata colony (one of the worst affected) to see if there were any eggs on it. We removed the colony and inspected it to find it infested with eggs, but soaking it in SeaChem only released one or two worms so the turkey basting/fish eating/fish-learning-to-hunt strategy seems to work.
We cut off the dead bottom of the prostrata that contained the eggs, and quartered the remaining colony. Each quarter was inspected for eggs, scraped, soaked in SeaChem, basted, soaked in SW, and glued onto the rock where it was originally (after cleeaning eggs off of the rock and soaking it in FW) and placed in my frag tank. There are 2 more colonies that are easily removable that will undergo this cleaning procedure.
All of my acro frags were inspected by both me and Dennis. To our surprise, there were no eggs found except for one grow-out colony: a pink millepora.
This colony was discarded since it was pretty much gone but first we soaked it in fresh water .......many many flatworms fell off. It was decided to discard this colony since I still have the mothercolony in the display, that seems not to be infected (no eggs or visible or worms flying off after basting) but will be treated via the turkey baster method.
The rest of the small acro frags were checked, dipped in SaeChem for around 30 minutes, blasted with a baster, soaked in SW to remove the SeaChem and placed into a sterile Q-tank separate from my system.
So I guess I will continue the turkey basting for any colonies not removable from my display, clean the removable ones, and keep the Q-Tank up and running as a last resort with hopefully "clean" frags to start over.
The main point here isthat certain fish love these worms as food and seemingly can be trained to hunt for them. Especially good at this task is the Goldflake Angel, Copperband Butterfly, and Hardwicke Wrasse that has already proven useful to German aquarists for purposes of FW eradication.
When I got home after work yesterday, I noticed my Goldflake Angel, Copperband Butterfly and to a smaller extent the Hardwicke wrasse all spending time under the branches of my affected corals and actually picking stuff off them. These fish have never exhibited this behavior in the past. Only when I started turkey basting did these fish sort of "learn" to hunt for the flatworms. When turkey basting the GF and CBB fight with each other to get into position under the corals to catch the flatworms as they blow off!
Each day there are less and less worms. However Dennis and I decided to pull out my Prostarata colony (one of the worst affected) to see if there were any eggs on it. We removed the colony and inspected it to find it infested with eggs, but soaking it in SeaChem only released one or two worms so the turkey basting/fish eating/fish-learning-to-hunt strategy seems to work.
We cut off the dead bottom of the prostrata that contained the eggs, and quartered the remaining colony. Each quarter was inspected for eggs, scraped, soaked in SeaChem, basted, soaked in SW, and glued onto the rock where it was originally (after cleeaning eggs off of the rock and soaking it in FW) and placed in my frag tank. There are 2 more colonies that are easily removable that will undergo this cleaning procedure.
All of my acro frags were inspected by both me and Dennis. To our surprise, there were no eggs found except for one grow-out colony: a pink millepora.
This colony was discarded since it was pretty much gone but first we soaked it in fresh water .......many many flatworms fell off. It was decided to discard this colony since I still have the mothercolony in the display, that seems not to be infected (no eggs or visible or worms flying off after basting) but will be treated via the turkey baster method.
The rest of the small acro frags were checked, dipped in SaeChem for around 30 minutes, blasted with a baster, soaked in SW to remove the SeaChem and placed into a sterile Q-tank separate from my system.
So I guess I will continue the turkey basting for any colonies not removable from my display, clean the removable ones, and keep the Q-Tank up and running as a last resort with hopefully "clean" frags to start over.
The main point here isthat certain fish love these worms as food and seemingly can be trained to hunt for them. Especially good at this task is the Goldflake Angel, Copperband Butterfly, and Hardwicke Wrasse that has already proven useful to German aquarists for purposes of FW eradication.
Chuck Spyropulos
Non-member
Forgot to mention that finding the worms on the corals is extremely difficult since the blend in so well. However, it seems that SeaCham Reef Dip Coral Disinfectant iseems to be a reliable way of geting the FWs to let go of the coral and fall off. The eggs are readily visible.
